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Poll Question: How does your APU generator work? (Ground, engines OFF)

No problems    
  18 (32.7%)
No power in 5-10 minutes    
  37 (67.3%)




Total votes: 55
« Created by: Captain Sim on: Apr 30th, 2012 at 6:02pm »

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 25 737 locks up (Read 92383 times)
Crabs25
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #75 - Jan 1st, 2013 at 10:54pm
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Hello all. I know this is an old topic but despite following the procedures as I understand them, the same thing is happening to me. I quote a previous poster;


Battery on
#1 aft boost pump on
start APU
APU bleed open
Isolation valve auto
AC/DC selectors to Standby and APU Gen
position lights on
galley power on
packs 1 on

wait 11 minutes:

radios dead
instrument (altimeter?) sound stops
amps/volts look okay
pneumatics normal with APU running

Then I shut down APU, and battery.
Now, Battery on = no battery power. I am able to flip all switches, but there is no electrical power.

This thread just seemed to fizzle out. Did a solution ever get provided?

Thanks,

Paul
  

[imghttp://www.captainsim.com/user/dl/x737/x737_T.jpg
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marvic
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #76 - Jan 1st, 2013 at 11:16pm
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There is no official fix. Did you try this? I quoted it from the post.

"It did happen every time unless I started the APU before I clicked on any FSX menu items. the APU gen was on.
I tried using the external power and air start when this happens but no joy. I tried the same as Markoz, and the default aircraft with engines running and still no battery power and the engines would not start. I even tried the CTRL E... nothing. Shut down FSX and re-started. No issues everything was working. This happened a couple of times until I put in the electric_always_available=1 line in the config. I know it's not realistic or a fix."
Marvic

electric_always_available=1
  

Cheers, Mark Win7 64bit, i5 2500K 4.2Ghz, Gigabit Z68X-UD4-BE, GSkill 12800 DDR3 8gig ram, GTX960,WD 2t, 250gb SSD, P3Dv3, GSX, REX E. EZDok, Accu-Feel, ORBX,Track IR5, Saitek PRO; Yoke, pedals, Xtra throttles & headset
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bhuntsy
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #77 - Jan 1st, 2013 at 11:31pm
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I was just going to ask you about that post.  Have you found that starting the APU and putting it on the bus before clicking any menu items is an effective work around to this problem?  Or does it still fail sometimes?

I haven't flown my 732 in a while because of this bug.  I'm just re-installing now to try this.

Thanks
  
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Crabs25
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #78 - Jan 1st, 2013 at 11:31pm
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Hello, thanks for your quick answer.

Do you mean have I tried the "electric always available" fix?  No, not yet.

Is this likely to be something that gets fixed in a future pack do we know?
  

[imghttp://www.captainsim.com/user/dl/x737/x737_T.jpg
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marvic
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #79 - Jan 2nd, 2013 at 12:42am
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Crabs25 wrote on Jan 1st, 2013 at 11:31pm:
Hello, thanks for your quick answer.

Do you mean have I tried the "electric always available" fix?  No, not yet.

Is this likely to be something that gets fixed in a future pack do we know?


I would like to thinks so. I am still waiting patiently for the service pack.
  

Cheers, Mark Win7 64bit, i5 2500K 4.2Ghz, Gigabit Z68X-UD4-BE, GSkill 12800 DDR3 8gig ram, GTX960,WD 2t, 250gb SSD, P3Dv3, GSX, REX E. EZDok, Accu-Feel, ORBX,Track IR5, Saitek PRO; Yoke, pedals, Xtra throttles & headset
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Markoz
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #80 - Jan 2nd, 2013 at 3:00am
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It is worth noting that if you own a registered version of FSUIPC, you can increase the life of the battery by a factor of X (with 0 (zero) being infinite), which could help with avoiding the problem. In all honesty, I only use this on the Flight1 Cessna Mustang because the battery on that is usually flat before I finish inserting the flight plan!
  

Mark Fletcher



PC: i7 10700K @3.8/5.1GHz | 64GB DDR4 3200 | 12GB RTX 4070 Super | 32" LCD Monitor | 1TB SSD & 2x2TB SSD | Win 11 Pro - FSX/FSX-SE/P3D3/P3D4/P3D5/P3D6/MSFS2020
15.6" Gaming Laptop: i7 7700HQ | 32GB DDR4 | 6GB GTX 1060 | 256GB SSD & 1TB HDD | Win 10 Pro 64bit - FSX-SE/P3D4
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Crabs25
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #81 - Jan 2nd, 2013 at 12:45pm
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Good. I do hope the fix it.

The way I work is to get the aircraft up and running on the APU or ground power, then set the Nav frequency and instruments for departure, set the performance computer of FMC as the case may be then start up.

The setting up and programming can take 10-15 mins but I don't have this luxury in the 200. With it being VOR & NDB Nav, it take longer to set up as I don't just follow the pink line!

Paul
  

[imghttp://www.captainsim.com/user/dl/x737/x737_T.jpg
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esteban
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #82 - Jan 2nd, 2013 at 8:08pm
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Hello you have Fsuipc on payware?
Shocked
  
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Crabs25
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #83 - Jan 2nd, 2013 at 8:55pm
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esteban wrote on Jan 2nd, 2013 at 8:08pm:
Hello you have Fsuipc on payware?
Shocked


No, just the unregistered one.
  

[imghttp://www.captainsim.com/user/dl/x737/x737_T.jpg
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bud7h7
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #84 - Jan 3rd, 2013 at 12:56am
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electric_always_available=1 did not work for me, I had to use FSUIPC unlimited battery.

Then there is still the problem of gauges/controls locking up occasionally after accessing the FSX menu bar before engines are running.
  

Bud Estrada i5 2500k @ 4.4 - p67 extreme4 - GTX580 - 16gb RAM - Windows 7/64 - FSX SP2
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Markoz
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #85 - Jan 3rd, 2013 at 1:55am
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Quote:
Then there is still the problem of gauges/controls locking up occasionally after accessing the FSX menu bar before engines are running.

You need to make sure all the switches are where they should be after accessing the menu. It's annoying, but doesn't take very much time to do.

Edit Jan 3rd, 2013 at 3:23am: I loaded the 737-200 into FSX. Provided External Power and Bleed Air. With my OH panel set like this:



after 1 hour and 4 minutes, I was able to start the 737-200! Everything was working like it should! No loss of power after more than 1 hour is pretty good IMO.
  

Mark Fletcher



PC: i7 10700K @3.8/5.1GHz | 64GB DDR4 3200 | 12GB RTX 4070 Super | 32" LCD Monitor | 1TB SSD & 2x2TB SSD | Win 11 Pro - FSX/FSX-SE/P3D3/P3D4/P3D5/P3D6/MSFS2020
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Bobby Boucher
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #86 - Jan 7th, 2013 at 3:26pm
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I too have this problem.. have been following this (these) threads.. for a while now..

Let's try looking at it, "forest from the trees"... meaning, it shouldn't matter how inept the user might be, as far as power management goes..

Even if he jumps in, turns just the battery on, and then powers up the avionics and all the lights.. then goes for a walk (obviously draining the battery).. comes back hours later.. ground-power should allow him to fire-up the APU, and start the engines.. right ?

I think it's power hierarchy/logic problem.. like the only way the the engine-start-sequencer can be powered, is by the FSX battery.. and the only way to charge, or keep the FSX battery charged, is via engine driven generators.

The engine-start-sequencer should be able to get power from ground-power, or the APU.. OR the battery itself should be able to maintain a charge (or get re-charged) by either (or both) the ground-power, or the APU .. right ?

I've poked around all the XML gauge folders, and I've seen no reference to, "Aircraft Variables" .. only references to "Local Variables". My guess is, that CS needed to define a lot of stuff independent of FSX, to make its systems "work".. and along the lines, the battery/avionics/starters, ect.. ended up with an illogical set of interactions... leaving "broken" connections.

All of the gauge folders, and XML files, and local-variables are named by proprietory/cryptic conventions.. so I can't debug this. My XML skills are limited to my own, freeware work (found under the name, "Brett Henderson"), but I know enough to know that this can be a simple, "hot fix", long overdue. It severly limits a sim-pilot from using realistic, emmersive pre-flight practices.. a large reason for why we but these beautiful models..
  
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AirCanadaGuy
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #87 - Jan 7th, 2013 at 6:59pm
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For an aircraft starting at the gate with bleed air, the aircraft's APU is most likely INOP awaiting maintenance.

I had to do some ground run ups and the ground crew would connect a hose about a foot in diameter that would supply the bleed air. We did this right before pushback, and usually the #1 engine would be started using the bleed air. It was loud. The ground start air supply was a large diesel engine that would turn a large compressor which turned really fast to blow high velocity air.

During this time the GPU would already be connected (from when the aircraft was secured at the gate) directly below the cockpit and that would allow the avionics to work on the aircraft. It is 115 Volts AC and most aircraft that run a primary DC bus would have an inverter (rectifier). The battery would never have to be used at the gate as even if the APU wasn't operating we would connect the GPU while the aircraft engine was still running.

You should be able to start the APU using only the ground power. The battery is always on a standby mode incase of loss of power, I think.
  
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Bobby Boucher
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #88 - Jan 7th, 2013 at 7:19pm
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Quote:
You should be able to start the APU using only the ground power. The battery is always on a standby mode incase of loss of power, I think.


Right..  ground-power would be all you need even IF you let the battery drain..

And the start-sequencer/avionics should see power by any three of the sources (battery, ground-power, APU)..

The problem is that if you let the battery drain.. that's it.. no avionics\start-sequencer/APU startup.. nothing, no matter what you do..

The simplest fix would only need to let the start-sequencer work off APu or ground-power.. so at least you could charge the battery via engine-driven generators..
  
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AirCanadaGuy
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Re: 737 locks up
Reply #89 - Jan 7th, 2013 at 8:10pm
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Exactly...

I have had the battery drain because I forgot to switch to ground power. After loading fuel, pax and running checklists, it's very frustrating.
  
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