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 25 707 v1.2 (Read 20706 times)
TheFinn
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #15 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 6:14am
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Great work again CS!  Shocked Your 707 is now a real charm to fly with!  Smiley

The trim-wheel animation is indeed still a little buggy (the sound too when moved with key-commands). But at least the sound is now way better than before!

As for the pressurization system: In my 15 mins of test flight, it has somehow worked, but my cabin alt still was equal to the planes altitude. But I'm sure this was somehow my fault as it seems to work with others. Dunno what I've done wrong...  Huh

And thanks for fixing the NAV and COMM freq-knobs, this was the most annoying bug to me.  Smiley

Again, thumbs up for CS!  Cool
  

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Captain Sim 2
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #16 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 7:42am
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Thank you all!

Markoz wrote on Oct 20th, 2010 at 10:02pm:
I downloaded the manuals shortly after I downloaded the 707 v1.2. It appears that manuals 1 and 3 are the updated ones, PART II – Aircraft and Systems is not (it is dated 17 August, 2010).


Thanks, out fault. Correct Manual Part II just re-uploaded.
  
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Markoz
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #17 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 8:00am
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TheFinn wrote on Oct 21st, 2010 at 6:14am:
As for the pressurization system: In my 15 mins of test flight, it has somehow worked, but my cabin alt still was equal to the planes altitude. But I'm sure this was somehow my fault as it seems to work with others. Dunno what I've done wrong...  Huh
The pressurization gauge works for me. I've done quite a few flights and I have made adjustment to the Cabin Altitude and it worked.


In these two images, the yellow shows the settings I have selected and the altitude it actually is at (there is about a 400 foot difference). The blue circle shows my planes altitude (first image show FL185, second image shows FL315) they are correct (I leveled out at FL320 Wink).

Mark

Edit:

Captain Sim 2 wrote on Oct 21st, 2010 at 7:42am:
Thank you all!

Markoz wrote on Oct 20th, 2010 at 10:02pm:
I downloaded the manuals shortly after I downloaded the 707 v1.2. It appears that manuals 1 and 3 are the updated ones, PART II – Aircraft and Systems is not (it is dated 17 August, 2010).


Manual Part II will be updated today. We are sorry for delay.
Thanks Captain Sim
 Grin
  

Mark Fletcher



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TheFinn
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #18 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 8:26am
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That would be horribly wrong, because the big-needle is the pressure differential pressure, and NOT the cabin altitude. The small one would be the cabin-altitude.  Sad

Do you still get the yellow warnings in the overhead-panel while climbing above 10'000ft?
  

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Markoz
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #19 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 9:05am
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Quote:
That would be horribly wrong, because the big-needle is the pressure differential pressure, and NOT the cabin altitude. The small one would be the cabin-altitude.  Sad
I believe it is correct because the outer numbers go from 0 up to 10, with 10,000 feet cabin pressure being about as high as you would want to have it. The inner numbers go from 0 to 50 and the 707's service ceiling is about 41000 - 43000 feet (AFAIK). Probably higher.

Quote:
Do you still get the yellow warnings in the overhead-panel while climbing above 10'000ft?
I've never noticed, nor looked, lately. I'll check it out on my next flight.

Mark
  

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TheFinn
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #20 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 9:30am
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Read what is written on the gauge itself, the outer scale is "DIFF. PRESS P.S.I" and the inner is "CAB ALT".

And I know how this gauge works from the best simulated 727 available for FS9. This gauge does not have an indication of the planes actual altitude, just the differential pressure and cabin altitude.
  

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SoulFlight
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #21 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 12:59pm
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Great, two days after I bought the product, CS releases it with 10 € off.

I LOVE YOU ALL!  Tongue


Great work anyways.....
  
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Markoz
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #22 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 1:28pm
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I had a look at the gauge and I see you are right with what is written on the face of the gauge. The only thing is, I was going by something that LOU posted about the cabin pressurization HERE. He wrote:


In this screen capture of the 707 pressure panel the plane is at FL250, all bleeds are open, the 3 turbo compressors are running, both packs on, and as you can see the auto selector is set to 4,000' and the cabin is around 6,000' and coming down at 1,400 fpm, but the manual controller has almost full DECREASE pressure selected.  Before I started using the manual controller (just using the auto controller) the cabin was climbing even though a lower altitude is selected in the auto controller. When I selected INCREASE pressure on the manual controller the cabin climbed higher.

I took it that, from what he said and the needle positions on the gauges in the image, that the way I described it was correct.

SoulFlight wrote on Oct 21st, 2010 at 12:59pm:
Great, two days after I bought the product, CS releases it with 10 € off.

I LOVE YOU ALL!  Tongue


Great work anyways.....
That's the story of my life. Grin

@LOU. I hope you don't mind my using you image in this post.

Mark
  

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speck
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #23 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 2:18pm
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All I can say Wow for V1.2. A huge improvement over V1.0 in the quickest of times. Thanks Captain Sim and thanks to all the 707 fans out there whose high standards made it possible. I'm a very happy sim pilot Cheesy
  

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CoolP
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #24 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 6:13pm
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Guys and fellow Captains, I've set up the post 1.2 bug list and I'm hoping to see you there.
http://www.captainsim.org/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1287684648/0#0

Thanks for the work on the post 1.1 one and if you don't mind, I'd like to grab your pictures and post them in that list to have one thread to discuss and explain all currently remaining bugs.

Thanks for your help.  Smiley
  
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #25 - Oct 21st, 2010 at 9:47pm
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You´re right Finn!
A similiar gauge can still be found on all 737´s. (and on 727)
And the big needle with the outer scale is the differential pressure and the small needle with the inner scale is the cabin altitude!
As I just downloaded the V 1.2, I´ll give it try to see how the pressurization is working now...
Greets,
Michael
  

757-200 /-300&&767-300 /-200&&727-100 /-200/ Freighter&&C-130 Basepack&&B-52 Exterior&&707-300/Freighter&&737-200&&&&-----------------------------------------------------&&&&Greets,&&Michael
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LOU
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Re: 707 v1.2
Reply #26 - Oct 27th, 2010 at 5:16pm
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I had a look at the gauge and I see you are right with what is written on the face of the gauge. The only thing is, I was going by something that LOU posted about the cabin pressurization HERE. He wrote:



In this screen capture of the 707 pressure panel the plane is at FL250, all bleeds are open, the 3 turbo compressors are running, both packs on, and as you can see the auto selector is set to 4,000' and the cabin is around 6,000' and coming down at 1,400 fpm, but the manual controller has almost full DECREASE pressure selected.  Before I started using the manual controller (just using the auto controller) the cabin was climbing even though a lower altitude is selected in the auto controller. When I selected INCREASE pressure on the manual controller the cabin climbed higher.

I took it that, from what he said and the needle positions on the gauges in the image, that the way I described it was correct.



Mark and all, sorry for the confusion!

In the above image, the cabin is at aircraft altitude - about 26,500' (the small inside needle)
The cabin differential shows just a bit over 5 PSI.
I think the needles are reversed in the program since I selected 4,000' for the cabin altitude, but there is something else wrong. Unless I used the manual controller the cabin was climbing at a high rate. when I used the manual controller to INCREASE pressure it just kept climbing. If you look close, you will see that I have cranked in DECREASE pressure on the manual controller to get the cabin to go down.

Something is cattywompus (an aviation technical term) in the pressure panel program.

Remember, the two controllers -AUTO & MANUAL- are connected.

The manual controller just has a stronger input to the outflow valves and of course there is no auto protection to stop at a selected altitude. The outflow valves still have the auto (8.6PSI) limit, and emergency(9.42PSI) relief so the cabin will not exceed max differential.

The way it works is like this:
You would first select - in auto pressure controller- a higher altitude. (ex. if you are at a sea level airport you would select 1,000 or 2,000 feet above the airport altitude. This was to soften the down pressure "bump" when you started to pressurize the cabin.

After engine start, (all doors closed) you would start the first turbo compressor and see how big a bump you would get. Some F/E's would use the thrust valve switch to soften the bump. Before turbo start they would close the thrust valve and open it as the turbo compressor came up to speed. Some of the turbo compressors would come on slowly and others would start fast, you never knew.

After all engines are started, and all turbos are running and the cabin stable, you would slowly bring the cabin down to just a bit below aircraft altitude. This was to avoid some surges in the cabin pressure during takeoff and during rotation. This slight amount of "head" pressure would help soften surges - but not in all cases. Remember this is ART not science, it's like playing music.

After takeoff, the F/E would select DECREASE rate on the small knob of the auto controller, then crank up the auto pressure controller S L O W L Y at first to an altitude a bit higher than cruise altitude. Look at the inner window at the top center of the auto controller. It shows "FLIGHT ALT AT MAX DIFFerential." You would want to be a bit higher in selected cabin altitude (1,500 to 2,000") to avoid the auto pressure relief valve from letting go. Remember it's ART - each plane was just like a person - different! Even though the relief was advertised as 8.6 PSI, you never knew! Once the cabin altitude was selected, you could adjust the rate knob to climb at a smooth rate. (300 to 500 FPM) If altitude was changed during flight the F/E would have to re-set the auto controller. Also, if the plane was light the F/E would have to increase the rate of climb of the cabin so as not to be overtaken in climb which would result in playing with the relief valve - not a pretty sight! The F/A's would all let the poor F/E know how much they enjoyed the "bump."

On the way down the reverse was true. You would select DEC on the rate knob, slowly move the cabin altitude selector to the selected airport altitude and maybe just a few feet more. (landing at an airport of 1,000' above sea level, you might put in 975' for the same reason as above.) The F/E would have to keep an eye on the progress of the cabin so as not to let the plane catch the cabin. If that happened, the cabin would descend at the same rate as the aircraft. (See comment above about F/A's wrath!) Another problem on some planes - 727 as well - was that at low power settings during descent, there was not enough airflow from the turbos (or bleed air-727) to keep the cabin going down. Closing the thrust valve on the 707 or the cargo heat valve on the 727 would help conserve air pressure, but some of the planes leaked so bad that some power was needed on at least one of the engines to keep the cabin under control.

Hope this was not too long, but that should clear up the confusion.

Lou
  

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