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 25 CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE (Read 327073 times)
asanal
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #165 - Mar 19th, 2011 at 4:42am
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I found my two errors were causing to fail INS DME update.

After completion of VOR?DME elevation entry (3+9) you have  turn knob to  Way point Distance and verify  loaded distance=DME distance. Then press Waypoint Distance on,then press waypoint number where yo insert the coordinates, THEN Press INSERT to Light OFF. (Some reason I wasn't pressing insert off, therefore DME update was falling, then some times I was  selecting WAYP and DIS/TIME . This is another way failing the DME update.)
Now I am careful about these two mistakes, DME update working well.
  
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Markoz
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #166 - Mar 19th, 2011 at 5:54am
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asanal wrote on Mar 19th, 2011 at 4:42am:
I found my two errors were causing to fail INS DME update.

After completion of VOR?DME elevation entry (3+9) you have  turn knob to  Way point Distance and verify  loaded distance=DME distance. Then press Waypoint Distance on,then press waypoint number where yo insert the coordinates, THEN Press INSERT to Light OFF. (Some reason I wasn't pressing insert off, therefore DME update was falling, then some times I was  selecting WAYP and DIS/TIME . This is another way failing the DME update.)
Now I am careful about these two mistakes, DME update working well.
I'm sure I'm not doing that, but who knows, maybe I am.
I'll let you all know how I go.

Mark
  

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CoolP
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #167 - Mar 19th, 2011 at 6:45am
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Just to let you know. Although I might seem to be able to operate that Civa INS, I can't really say that its handling is somehow intuitive. In fact, it's not even close.
Which guy in the world would take three number-only display lines, a multi labelled switch and some blinking (or not blinking) signs to advertise an intuitive navigation source for aircraft? Back then, it was high-tech though.

But, I admit, it's fun later, when you get that thing running (somehow) and can experience the awkwardness of operating an oldschool airliner like our beloved 707, 727 and even the B-52.
So good luck, buddy, it's like reading the Matrix for the very first time.  Cool

Quote:
Now I am careful about these two mistakes, DME update working well.

Glad to read this. Happy and accurate flights then.  Smiley
  
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kiniu
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #168 - Apr 21st, 2011 at 2:53pm
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Hello all simmer

Finally I install successfully civa nav panel on my 707 1.3 v
I follow the tutorial from youtube how to setup align ,add way point ....
I wait till green light goes off , take off switch to AP on nav1 setup to 1st way point freq and course as well switch NAV on autopilot and airplane always fly to hdg 300 deg. newer follow the route which is setup on civa.
I program 4 way points I also check distance between each one and is ok.
Why airplane don't want to follow the route?
Please if somebody can do any video tutorial which show how to successfully setup civa nav system I will be very grateful.
Thank you in advance and sorry for my poor English .
Kind regards
Chris
  

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CoolP
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #169 - Apr 21st, 2011 at 4:13pm
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Is your DOPPLER/INS switch in the INS position then? Otherwise the AP won't listen to the Civa but waits for the Doppler system to drive him.
Does the Civa show any error code in the display?
  
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kiniu
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #170 - Apr 21st, 2011 at 4:44pm
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CoolP wrote on Apr 21st, 2011 at 4:13pm:
Is your DOPPLER/INS switch in the INS position then? Otherwise the AP won't listen to the Civa but waits for the Doppler system to drive him.
Does the Civa show any error code in the display?


Switch doppler/ins is on INS position / I read this post from 1st page and I will not ask for help if I can do something by my self .
Civa not showing any error and I align my position with engine off and park brake on.

No idea what's wrong .
Please do short video tutorial I think this will help many of us.
Regards
Chris
  

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CoolP
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #171 - Apr 21st, 2011 at 6:18pm
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I'm not so much into videos, but there should already be more than a few out there.

Can you describe your current steps one by one? So we can correct or comment on them. Seems like you are missing something.
  
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kiniu
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #172 - Apr 21st, 2011 at 7:16pm
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Ok I will describe my current steps one by one on photos .
I will show everything I'm doing from cold and dark and hopefully you can find what i'm doing wrong.
Thanks for help
Chris
  

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kiniu
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #173 - Apr 21st, 2011 at 9:30pm
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Hello all
Here it is my step by step civa programing tutorial not working as it should please find what I may do wrong

Flight plan EGSS:EDDF   CLN->TULIP->TEBRO->COL
ENGINE OFF my current position



Align my position I wait till no 95 change to 5 or less


I wait 45 min for green light to goes off but no luck so I turn nob for nav when both show (05) and light go off



I start adding way points to my route








So I have all 4 way point now let's check distance between them













After take off AP ON crs for CLN set freq SEt Switch to Nav and airplane not going direct to waypoint CLN it's look like NAV not working correctly on this time





After few min of flight HDG selector bar move to HDg 360 and plane follow this HDG And NAV is selected




I have no idea what is wrong with this system or my knowledge but I really want to use this system so if anyone can help me with this I will be very  grateful

Regards
CHris


  

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CoolP
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #174 - Apr 22nd, 2011 at 1:11pm
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Impressive work there, catching all the stuff in the screens, kiniu.
So lets see if I can help you then.

First of all, try to make use of the ADEU flight plan reader to avoid entering the waypoints manually. This manual approach may be cool on shorter routes, but as longer ones come in, you will be very tired from the typing alone and you are running the risk of entering stuff wrongly while the ADEU reader would just read your given flight plan and programs the INS for you.
You would only check the data entries then, like a good pilot would do. So much workload saved and safety gained then.
See the link to some neat flight plan converted on p.1 of this thread.

Second tip, always set up your current position in the INS. Even if it already shows the right coordinates, type them in again after bringing the units alive. See this as some sort of forced reset for the things.

Concerning your problem. When you look at the screens where the units are in the DSRTK mode, you will see that the INS actually commands the headings you are flying. So it seems like the INS to AP links works, but the commands from the INS doesn't seem to match your expectations.

For instance, this picture shows that the INS is on the leg from waypoint 0 to waypoint 1. 0 would describe your current position and 1 is the first waypoint of the plan. Now, since the unit is in the DSRTK mode, it will show you the desired track in the left side of the display. In this case, it's a heading of 96 degrees. So the unit tells you that it's now trying to track those 96 degrees which will result of a aircraft heading of around 96 since the INS does some corrections for the winds.
Your CDI shows you to be on 96 degrees, so the command chain INS to AP works. Conclusion, the technical side of your setup is ok.



Now, what could be the problem in your setup?
As said, the technical side is ok, the logical one seems to struggle.

You can always force the INS to reset the desired track by using the direct-to operation. If you want to go from your current position (which then will be 0) to the first waypoint of your plan, you have to press WYPT CHG, 0 (=current pos) and the number of the waypoint you'd like to go to, in this case 1. Last step, press INSERT.
The desired track then gets recalculated, showing the exact value which is necessary to turn the aircraft directly to the waypoint which was desired.
Try to perform this direct-to action when entering the runway or just before switching the AP over to the INS navigation, to ensure that the desired track calculated takes your current position into account. You have to force this recalculation to update the leg between 0 and 1.
If you, after taking off, are commanded directly to waypoint 3 of your flight plan, you therefore will press WYP CHG, 0, 3 and INSERT. Check the desired track in the INS display and then connect the INS to the AP if not already connected.

The other possible error source are wrong coordinates. If you for example mix up some numbers for the first waypoint, the INS will think of "I have to go South" while you are expecting it to go North.
So check those numbers to make sure that everything is fine. I sometimes mixed up numbers or even West and East (or North and South) coordinates, leading to a useless INS then since it takes you around the globe then.  Grin

So the pre-activation check of the INS (=before you connect it to the AP) will always mean that you look at that desired track when in the DSRTK mode. Does it match your roughly assumed flight plan route? If so, enable the AP link. If not, stay on manual headings and check the data in the units.
  
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kiniu
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #175 - Apr 22nd, 2011 at 2:38pm
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Thank You CoolP for your help I will try one more time this evening right now I'm on the middle of flying KJFK ->LSZH with MD11 much easier is fly when you have FMC Smiley

Thanks
Chris
  

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Markoz
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #176 - Apr 22nd, 2011 at 3:49pm
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kiniu wrote on Apr 22nd, 2011 at 2:38pm:
I'm on the middle of flying KJFK ->LSZH with MD11 much easier is fly when you have FMC Smiley

That one is too easy! I put in all the different altitudes for the step climbs, and when the time comes, up she goes. It's a great long haul aircraft (overnight) because I can go to bed and finish in the morning, knowing that it has climbed higher to consume less fuel while I slept. Tongue

Mark
  

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asanal
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #177 - Apr 22nd, 2011 at 9:33pm
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Current position, try to load LON:E0, 13,22 to INS as follows:

E not West (W) in POS Wink
  
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kiniu
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #178 - Apr 22nd, 2011 at 10:20pm
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asanal wrote on Apr 22nd, 2011 at 9:33pm:
Current position, try to load LON:E0, 13,22 to INS as follows:

E not West (W) in POS Wink

Thank you I will try and let you know .I have to get this thing working !
  

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CoolP
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Re: CIVA INS - THE ONLY THREAD PLEASE
Reply #179 - Apr 23rd, 2011 at 12:29am
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I can feel that you're getting closer.  Smiley

I hope you don't feel offended, but when I see that my problem has some logical nature, I stop the thing and approach it on the next day or so, after sleeping some time. There are days where you don't see or get a thing although it's clearly there. Next day, fresh eyes and mind, easy to catch.

If the problem is on the technical side though, I blame the devs.  Cheesy
  
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