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Stuck autothrottle (Read 10381 times)
parsec71
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Stuck autothrottle
Apr 28th, 2019 at 3:00pm
 
I purchased the 777 base pack yesterday (beta 0.3), and after a couple of aborted flights, I want to share my feedback on this aircraft. I'm always honest with developers, because it's my experience after 30+ years of dealing with software that that's the only way to do it. I also want to use my vast sim experience to push CS to new heights, having thousands of hours in FSX, FSW, X-Plane and P3D in all major dev's aircraft.

The first thing I noticed with this 777 is a performance issue especially noticeable in the cockpit. When FPS drops below 25, the human eye start to notice it, and this aircraft is at 15 to 19 FPS on ground on my computer (i7-6700K/GTX 1070 8 GB/32 GB RAM, P3D v4.4). So obviously there's some (excessive) processing going on in some systems or the gauges/panels. Outside the 777 I get about 30 FPS. As I've understood I'm not the only one having this experience, so this is something that must be looked at.

The real show-stopper for me is the fact that the (auto)throttle gets stuck at cruise. Follow the link below to watch a YT-video. No matter what I do, the throttle is stuck and keeps accelerating the aircraft. The video also shows the low FPS (Fraps in upper left corner).

Meters should disappear completely after pressing MTRS, the 777 still show it above the purple feet indication top right of the PFD.

VNAV logic is where devs show their skills. The CS 777 is pitching at maximum angle given speed or thrust available. This is not how Boeing (or Airbus for that matter) does it in real life. The nose will bob up and down as the aircraft searches for optimum climb angle while maintaining the speed set in the FMC. This is beautifully and realistically done by a competing dev, but I'm sure CS is capable of recreating this logic for their 777.

If CS can put fuel and pax/cargo load in the EFB or FMC/CDU, that would be lovely.

The outside 3D model looks stunning, just like the 757 which is the most beautiful re-creation in any sim. The cockpit is okay, but the panels could have had a more Boeing-like typeface or at least a more clear text appearance.

Link to video (unlisted YT video, only available if you have the link):

youtu.be/5uc75jgD5No

(As I've not posted 3 times in this forum, I'm not allowed to make the link click-able. Sorry for that...)
  
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Markoz
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #1 - Apr 28th, 2019 at 8:59pm
 
parsec71 wrote on Apr 28th, 2019 at 3:00pm:
The real show-stopper for me is the fact that the (auto)throttle gets stuck at cruise. No matter what I do, the throttle is stuck and keeps accelerating the aircraft.

While the 777 did this to me on the first 2 flights I did in v0.1, and the first flight I did in v0.2, it never did it in any flights following those ones, and it hasn't done it at all in v0.3.

Note. To stop the overspeeding, I pressed the IAS/MACH Selector switch, and rolled the speed back to .85, then pressed the IAS/MACH Selector switch a second time, and it would follow the 0.833 that was showing on the VNAV CRZ page. So at least I had a work-around for the problem when it did happen.
  

Mark Fletcher



PC: i7 10700K @3.8/5.1GHz | 64GB DDR4 3200 | 12GB RTX 4070 Super | 32" LCD Monitor | 1TB SSD & 2x2TB SSD | Win 11 Pro - FSX/FSX-SE/P3D3/P3D4/P3D5/P3D6/MSFS2020
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DV006
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #2 - Apr 28th, 2019 at 10:46pm
 
I too am having a similar problem.  I had done a couple of successful flights, but then the autothrottle started to act just like described.  My flight plan called for a cruise of .833 mach at fl340.  As soon as i reached that cruise, the speed continued to climb.  I tried as you told to click on the speed button and adjust the mach reading to .85 and then click on it again, my speed continued to increase.  i click on the speed button again and now I am up to mach.891, so I adjust it back to .833 and click on the speed button again and it continues to increase speed again.  Click on the speed button again and now it is up to .893.  Nothing seems to keep it under control, unless i am misunderstanding what you are instructing.  Not sure what you are saying by pressing the ias/mac button.  It does nothing to let me change it.  Only the speed button does.  Thanks.
  
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Markoz
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #3 - Apr 29th, 2019 at 3:07am
 
If you look at the attached image (screenshot of the MCP):

In the red box is the IAS/MACH Reference Switch.
In the yellow box is the IAS/MACH Display - scrolling the mouse wheel up/down, while the mouse pointer is hovering over the window (AND the speed is displayed on it) will change the speed up, or down.
In the green box is the IAS/MACH Selector Switch - if you click on it when using VNAV mode, the speed will display in the IAS/MACH Display above it, and use the mouse wheel on it changes the speed up/down, and it's this switch that I was clicking on and using to slow the 777 down.

Quote:
‘777 Captain’ MANUAL Part II – Aircraft and Systems (CS777CAPTAINII_MANUAL_PART2.pdf) page 33:

13. IAS / MACH Selector

When not in VNAV, the IAS/MACH window shows the current target airspeed.
Turn the IAS/MACH selector to change the target airspeed.

In VNAV, the IAS/MACH window is normally blank. If you push the selector, the
window unblanks to show thecurrent FMC target airspeed.
You can then turn the IAS/MACH selector tochange the target airspeed. This
is speed intervention.

  

2019-4-29_12-43-19-168.jpg ( 121 KB | 159 Downloads )
2019-4-29_12-43-19-168.jpg

Mark Fletcher



PC: i7 10700K @3.8/5.1GHz | 64GB DDR4 3200 | 12GB RTX 4070 Super | 32" LCD Monitor | 1TB SSD & 2x2TB SSD | Win 11 Pro - FSX/FSX-SE/P3D3/P3D4/P3D5/P3D6/MSFS2020
15.6" Gaming Laptop: i7 7700HQ | 32GB DDR4 | 6GB GTX 1060 | 256GB SSD & 1TB HDD | Win 10 Pro 64bit - FSX-SE/P3D4
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Markoz
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #4 - Apr 29th, 2019 at 4:43am
 
Ouch! I just had this happen to me for the first time in v0.3, but I was flying the 777-300ER GE115B (it's the first time I have flown the 777-300 in v0.3).

Pressing the IAS/MACH Selector Switch did not fix the problem, but as I was pressing the switch, I somehow wound up clicking on the IAS/MACH Reference Switch (MACH Speed showed .9xx in the speed display (I can't see exactly what it was, as Nvidia Shadowplay was recording at *medium quality in P3Dv4, and the video looks so crappy I can't read anything on the panels)), and when I clicked on it a second time, the throttle levers retarded, and the speed started dropping, and now the 777-300 is happily cruising along at .833, like it should be. Undecided

*Nvidia Shadowplay set at medium quality creates great videos in all my other games, but not in P3Dv4.
  

Mark Fletcher



PC: i7 10700K @3.8/5.1GHz | 64GB DDR4 3200 | 12GB RTX 4070 Super | 32" LCD Monitor | 1TB SSD & 2x2TB SSD | Win 11 Pro - FSX/FSX-SE/P3D3/P3D4/P3D5/P3D6/MSFS2020
15.6" Gaming Laptop: i7 7700HQ | 32GB DDR4 | 6GB GTX 1060 | 256GB SSD & 1TB HDD | Win 10 Pro 64bit - FSX-SE/P3D4
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parsec71
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #5 - Apr 29th, 2019 at 2:10pm
 
No matter which buttons I press, the stuck throttle won't go away. Third flight aborted, and I will leave this bird in the hangar for now until this bug is squashed.

Regarding the framerate issue, the panel config-file on the 200ER is 32 KB. A lot of stuff going on in that cockpit, which seriously impacts performance. The file on the 200LR from a competing dev is 21 KB...
  
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Captain Sim
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #6 - Apr 29th, 2019 at 2:12pm
 
parsec71 wrote on Apr 28th, 2019 at 3:00pm:
a performance issue especially noticeable in the cockpit.

Try to turn off the pax cabin.

We'll check the AT and if it's an easy fix will do it.

The fuel and payload manager will appear in the 1.0.
  
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parsec71
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #7 - Apr 29th, 2019 at 2:19pm
 
Captain Sim wrote on Apr 29th, 2019 at 2:12pm:
Try to turn off the pax cabin.


Done that, the increase in performance is minuscule, 2 or 3 fps.
  
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Captain Sim
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #8 - Apr 29th, 2019 at 2:51pm
 
parsec71 wrote on Apr 28th, 2019 at 3:00pm:
The real show-stopper for me is the fact that the (auto)throttle gets stuck at cruise.

Pls save the flight right at the issue and attach the files to your post. 
  
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DV006
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #9 - Apr 29th, 2019 at 3:45pm
 
Thanks for the further explanation.  I did a different flight from Denver to L.A. and again, the speed kept going up.  This time your fix did solve the problem.  Not sure why it would not work on the other flights that I tried that.  I will continue to use this fix for now, but do look for a permanent fix in the near future.
  
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Markoz
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #10 - Apr 30th, 2019 at 5:32am
 
It has happened twice today in the 777-300ER. I have saved the flight and attached it to this post.
  

CS777-300ER_Overspeed.zip ( 33 KB | 144 Downloads )

Mark Fletcher



PC: i7 10700K @3.8/5.1GHz | 64GB DDR4 3200 | 12GB RTX 4070 Super | 32" LCD Monitor | 1TB SSD & 2x2TB SSD | Win 11 Pro - FSX/FSX-SE/P3D3/P3D4/P3D5/P3D6/MSFS2020
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parsec71
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #11 - Apr 30th, 2019 at 9:41am
 
Here's a ZIP with the files from my 4th straight flight in which the A/T is stuck at cruise.

Another observation: The APU seems to burn way too much fuel, creating an unbalance in the tanks which in turn can't be corrected because the crossfeed isn't working (perhaps not modelled...).

Also, the engines and their derate, this is not modelled correctly. During climb, the green number on the EICAS/N1, this will be identical to the number actual shown in white which indicates which value the engines are running at. This is due to the fact the FADEC will always feed the engines what the pilots have allowed it to do through the derate temp selection. At the end of climb, the derate is perhaps 98%, but the indication shows perhaps only 90%.
  

777-200ER_stuck_autothrottle.zip ( 130 KB | 169 Downloads )
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DV006
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #12 - May 8th, 2019 at 10:04pm
 
I really do hope that Captain Sim will come up with a fix for the autothrottle problem that many are experiencing.  Today, I am flying and it took me over half an hour to get the cruise speed settled to what the flight plan called for.  This involved disconnecting the autopilot, turning off the autothrottle switches and numerous times, adjusting the mach speed with no resolution   Once it settled, I noticed that the altitude went up to a thousand feet above the planned altitude even though the altitude screen was set for 39000 feet which matched the cdu altitude.
   
Not sure what the problem is.  I thought this was a plane that was brought over from a 32 bit program and made into a 64 bit program to work with P3D.  Does changing the bit rate also affect a lot of the parameters which is what it is doing to the autothrottle?  I'm not a techy so I don't know.  All I know is that it is making it very difficult and frustrating to try to fly this wonderful plane.
  
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Dan Genaw
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #13 - May 13th, 2019 at 3:14am
 
Hello,

I'd just like to add that this happened to me as well. I was flying the 200ER with PW engines and the thrust levers were useless. The auto thrust wasn't stuck, but the thrust setting was. Meaning even disconnecting the AT and manually moving the thrust levers couldn't get the thrust setting to change. The levers were physically (well, virtually physically) moving but the EPR/N1% all stayed the same.

I have saved my flight and uploaded it. I am flying on P3D V4.5 on Win 10 Home edition.

Update: So I managed to regain control of my thrust settings. I turned off the AT and cycled the throttle on my joystick a number of times. (wasn't really counting but probably 20-30) Eventually, one engine decreased in thrust in accordance with the my control inputs. I turned on the AT, and both engines responded to it. I manged to recreate the stuck thrust setting by putting the aircraft into a climb using VS (vertical speed). Once again, turning off the AT and cycling the throttle on my joystick got the thrust working again. Again, I didn't really count the times but it felt like a lot.
  

PW200ER_Stuckthrottles.zip ( 143 KB | 116 Downloads )
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Captain Sim
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Re: Stuck autothrottle and other feedback
Reply #14 - May 13th, 2019 at 1:17pm
 
DV006 wrote on May 8th, 2019 at 10:04pm:
I really do hope that Captain Sim will come up with a fix for the autothrottle problem

We are working on it.
  
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