I fully agree on the drag ability of all the stuff on the 727. But despite the fact that she's able to slow down fast, this "jumping through the settings" would enable quite some hurry on the approach in my eyes.
As one should proceed calm and with enough time to react on possible errors, the slightly slower but more stable technique with the plane getting configured with enough time in between seems more promising to me.

I just thought about how I got "my" approach speeds, and please don't see my comments as critique on yours (which now also include the "190" setting).
I think that ATC talks you down to around 190 knots when they expect you to intercept the LOC. I heard those speeds most of the time when flying online and also remember hearing them on various cockpit videos.
Exceptions would be (at least online) a special/very heavy plane, but even the non-flap Concorde goes for 210-190 there (tends more to 210 though) and all the heavy stuff (or the bad slow-flyers, which would could be a 707 for example) seemed to aim for a max. of 190 then, mostly 180, to enable a smooth and stable LOC capture, being a very vital part on every precise approach.

They stay out at a min. of 160 knots then, until 5nm or so, for the ATC reasons given in the last post. So there's a range of 190 down to 160 for all approach related things in vicinity of being "final", while you slow down to your very special ref speed when being below 5nm out.

I've picked an example picture from the nice 727 docs from Matt Zagoren to show that the pre-landing config gets set soon while the speeds drop down real fast, especially when trying to catch one of those guidance signals (LOG and GS later).


So you can see a constant set-check-set-check cycle there, allowing to abort the thing when necessary and without getting in some sort of rush. I prefer it like this, I have to admit.
Maybe the real Captains around can offer their view on this too.

There will be exceptions around the planet of course, where this or that happens in another way as the somehow standard ones. ATC clearances might be one of them and I saw some EDDF controllers allowing the approach with no speed limits at all to enable some very fast descent before but also running the risk of getting the new pilots into the mentioned rush later.
In the rw (where this technique seems to come from), only Pros are flying, but in the sim, new pilots are more common. I'm often enough one of them.  

For us 727 flyers, the rather slow reacting AP is another factor to consider. Overshooting the LOC is more likely to happen when you're above 180 knots I think.

ddo2 wrote on Mar 14^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:


That's pretty weird.  Even before I solved the wildly oscillating yoke problem with Acceleration, I could still fly fine ILS or visual approaches at 150-160 knots at flaps 15 or 25, no problem.  Are you using flaps?

Sounds strange to me too (meaning that I haven't experienced your mentioned problems yet, ddo2). Before and after the flight model mod the 727 was a good handflyer and worked well on the precision approaches.
I recently did some touch&go training in the way I described earlier in this thread and everything worked fine, following the speeds in the additional docs (which are a great source together with using the FDE mod).

Can you try again or post your payload layout maybe?
I often had a fully loaded cargo -200 in the air (all containers are in), and around 45% of fuel, giving me around 69 tons to handle.
My MAC was in the operational range then and I was able to really follow the docs for landing her. Compared to handflying the 707, the 727 is a real charming planing while her older sister requires some work on the yokes.
From what I know, this matches the character of those two planes. 727 = fun, 707 = work.

Here's a quote from the fine docs regarding the 727 nose down tendency on the approach.
Quote:

Since Lou has quite some real world background there, which makes it easier for him to determine the speeds, I once again recommend the fine docs for the 727 for all the other guys (including me) to get some hints on the speeds and settings.
See this nice diagram and also the table for the Reference Speeds here for example, perfectly matching Lou's experience and also fitting nicely to the 727 in the sim.



Lou, I'm wondering if, apart from speed tables and calculations, the 727 could be flown "AoA" of some kind.
So If I know the normal pitch attitude of the plane at final, I could adjust the power to fit that pitch (and descend rate) and would automatically be on the correct speed for landing at that weight without ever watching the Airspeed Indicator or knowing about the weight.
Am I right from theory there or is this something which doesn't work at all?

ddo2 wrote on Mar 14^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:


What is your gross weight when this situation occurs?

Quote:

That situation came to my mind when looking for a reason to go via Pitch and descend rate only.
Thanks for the explanations, Lou.