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 10 EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust (Read 9087 times)
BorisCat
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EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust
Nov 19th, 2011 at 1:14pm
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Are there any figures for the EPR/N1 power settings for takeoff and rated thrust for climb? Also, any performance tables for climb/cruise/descent?
  
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Johan Nordqvist
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust
Reply #1 - Feb 23rd, 2012 at 7:36pm
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Well, there are some documents at Avsim that I don't remember the name of. Those documents do have some basic flight planning information. However, if you're like me and want as complete data as possible, then I would recommend you to take a look at this: http://www.esscoaircraft.com/p-8169-pan-am-pan-am-707-1976-operating-training-ma....

I bought it myself and I'm very pleased with it as it includes all EPR values that you could possibly need, fuel planning tables and etc... well EVERYTHING you need actually. (even tables for 2 & 3 engine operations)

It is available as either a printed version or as a download.
  

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Johan Nordqvist
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CoolP
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated th
Reply #2 - Feb 24th, 2012 at 8:41am
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Matt Zagoren is the guy offering some free docs for all sorts of planning purposes. I think the files are called 707perf.zip. But be aware that you can't give much on the EPR readings with FSX default engine models. Those will be off by large amounts, while the N1 sort of comes closer to the charted values.

Not so much a flaw of the 707, but of the FSX background. Only a dedicated and custom engine model could help. But the fuel planning and things works pretty good. You may see the sim showing slightly lower values though, so you may receive some more range than on the rw bird.
  
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Johan Nordqvist
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust
Reply #3 - Feb 24th, 2012 at 11:43am
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If there is someone who is able to fix the EPR issue or wants to fine-tune the fuel flow, contact me and I'll provide whatever data I can.
  

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Johan Nordqvist
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windplayer
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust
Reply #4 - Feb 24th, 2012 at 1:25pm
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There is a Michael2 on this forum. He did it for 727s. Im a huge fan of him Smiley flying his 727-100 by charts. anyway - just to fix epr - that could be easier then to fix engines + flight model. with 727 he spent 2 years (if i remember correctly) fixing it  Shocked
  
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CoastalDriver
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust
Reply #5 - Feb 25th, 2012 at 12:15am
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CoolIP is correct. The only stuff I have found on the net so far (that you don't have to pay for) is Matt Zogren's stuff which is at AVSIM. I have a copy of it and supplemented this with some material on the 707 from the Boeing website. I just worry about fuel flow and not so much about EPR as I have no idea what is precisely the engine version Capt Sim used as a base model for the engine algorithims. There are various engines with different cowl configurations so one size does not generally fit all if your after exact precision but they are all in the end about the same and I can live with the differences. Just keep the engine needles out the red zones and your right and the rest depends on the day you fly and what the outside air temps are where your flying or intending to fly and then go for the expected fuel burn per engine from the Zogren tables (which came from Boeing anyway).
  
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windplayer
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust
Reply #6 - Feb 25th, 2012 at 8:30am
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yep. but actually i read on this forum that Michael2 made some tunning on 707. but he needs complete perf tables. So if he succeed, then we'll have cool 707 with EPRs and FF Smiley
  
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CoolP
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust
Reply #7 - Feb 25th, 2012 at 9:49am
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We can always hope. The last news from Michael2 was that he's a young father now and that all tuning and tweaking is based on the 'as time permits' basis. So that's a thing to keep in mind. However, that's from some months ago.

On the actual problem with e. g. EPR readings, he had some tweaked gauge on the 727. So it got replaced and then delivered better values together with the other teaks of his. Now the 707 comes with 3D gauges and a change isn't that easy to do. I think he actually tried and received very funny pointers on the gauge itself.
In my humble eyes, the FDE tweak on the 727 helped a lot, while I think that the default 707 already gives a nice feel. So there may not be an urgent need.

However, I'm glad to read about some fans of his work. That's the best appreciation one can get and you folks can count me in.  Smiley
  
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windplayer
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust
Reply #8 - Feb 26th, 2012 at 7:42am
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yep. 3d gauges make it harder. and 3d kid even more, but i think 3d kid can make him much happier then 707s 3d gauges.

I like 707 out of the box too. Yesterday i made my first flight with it  Cool it's also easy to fly by hand. now i digging into fuel usage etc  Smiley
  
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Michael2
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated th
Reply #9 - Mar 5th, 2012 at 10:21pm
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Thanks for the kind words above.

I did start on a flight model mod for the 707.  However, I ran into a problem with the way the gauges are coded.  It was a while ago, but I seem to remember that the gauges had needles that were 3d objects that I couldn't control or get rid of.  I ended up having to add a second needle to the EPR  gauges and painting it with stripes so I would know which one to read.  And I could only get all four gauges to show readings for a single engine.  The end result would always be compromised and it just wasn't worth the time (and money for manuals) that I was spending on it.  

So now, after a period of time off from flight simming,  I am spending what time I have on creating a DC-8 from scratch.  It's a big project and I'm not entirely sure it will ever see the light of day, but I am afraid my days of modding other aircraft are all over.
  
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windplayer
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Re: EPR / N1 power settings for takeoff & rated thrust
Reply #10 - Mar 6th, 2012 at 4:51am
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does'nt matter. you still extremely super cool Smiley
  
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