Post by CoolP on Oct 1st, 2011 at 5:51am
Oh that FSX ATC, mysterious ways. ;D
I haven't used it for years, but I think "they" always vector you, no matter what. If there is terrain, it won't care much and since STARs and approach procedures usually avoid terrain or take things like proper separation possibilities into account, this may well conflict by design.
The AI planes fly those strange paths too.
I would recommend a program being capable of procedures or at least aware of them (remains silent on the actual procedure) for this, or online flying, which is the best in my eyes.
Or, complete silence, which is great too. :D
On that descent rate, you can gain awareness in many ways.
From the concept, the standard approaches aim for a 3 degree descent. Now you know! :D
As a rule of thumb, you will look at your groundspeed, lets say 160 knots, add a zero (x10) and then divide it by two. 160(0) / 2 = 800 ft/min. That's the rate you should aim for to be on a 3 degree downward path. You may add another notch on that VS wheel since your rule of thumb aims a bit low there, so 850 or 900 ft/min may be more appropriate.
Don't mix those degrees up with any pitch attitude shown on your instruments. Your aircraft's nose points at one direction, while the plane itself can travel along a different path and this path forms the 3 degree angle towards the runway.
Where else could you get the necessary descent rate?
Looking at the (approach) charts, the lower right corner offers a small table with examples of possible groundspeeds.
Those values are calculated, so no thumbs included, but some trigonometry. As a matter of fact, they show you a precise rate to aim at, so on our 3 degree approach, we will see something like 849 ft/min for a GS of 160 kts.
Remember the 'add one notch' thingy? There you are!
Another source is your capable plane and its FMC.
If the thing has VNAV, it can "draw" you a path right to the threshold. What it needs is some basic data, like the aircraft's groundspeed, its current altitude and later height and the point were planet Earth starts again.
Most of this stuff will be there, without any input from you. With e. g. the Flight Director enabled and VNAV connected, it will point to a pitch attitude where the plane stays on the desired path.
Also, the deviation scale on the ND comes up.
That thing can be a bit touchy in regard to the VNAV implementation, but since we are in the sim, no real persons (only egos) will get harmed. :D
To monitor your rate of descent and the point where the commanded altitude on the MCP will be reached, you can also follow the green arc on your ND. It will point at the spot ahead of you, where the plane and the commanded altitude will be on the same level.
Test it, raise the nose slightly and it will move further away. Lower it, and the arc will come closer if aiming for a lower altitude. Dial in the runway's altitude rounded to the next 100 and place the arc on the threshold.
Still, you are trying to shoot for that 3 degree approach towards the runway.
Any altered angles, for other approaches, can be read on the corresponding charts, together with the mentioned calculated values.
Be aware that anything above 5.5 degrees is a tough task for an airliner as the descent rate for our 160 kts groundspeed example e. g. rise from the shallow 849 ft/min to a whopping 1573 ft/min.
With that much vertical speed, there's not much headroom for trying to slow the plane down, so you will come in there fully configured most of the time.
That 5.5 degree approach can only be flown by certified planes and crews, so that's a special chapter and I think some of the other guys will have some neat examples for that stuff.
If you combine the things from above, you should be fail-safe in case anything of those things was wrong.
The guys like Lou will see if the approach is correct, they've done that often enough. The sim guys suffer from a more or less flat perspective and, of course, from way lesser experience.
If you often switch the planes, this also adds on the distracting side.
Of course, if you alter your groundspeed and for example slow the plane down, your VS has to be altered accordingly, the value gets lower. Got some tailwind and the GS suddenly goes up? VS has to be increased, and so on.
That's the experience and pilot part then, although that drawn path from the VNAV will of course help you, same goes for the green arc.
Have fun. :)
I haven't used it for years, but I think "they" always vector you, no matter what. If there is terrain, it won't care much and since STARs and approach procedures usually avoid terrain or take things like proper separation possibilities into account, this may well conflict by design.
The AI planes fly those strange paths too.
I would recommend a program being capable of procedures or at least aware of them (remains silent on the actual procedure) for this, or online flying, which is the best in my eyes.
Or, complete silence, which is great too. :D
On that descent rate, you can gain awareness in many ways.
From the concept, the standard approaches aim for a 3 degree descent. Now you know! :D
As a rule of thumb, you will look at your groundspeed, lets say 160 knots, add a zero (x10) and then divide it by two. 160(0) / 2 = 800 ft/min. That's the rate you should aim for to be on a 3 degree downward path. You may add another notch on that VS wheel since your rule of thumb aims a bit low there, so 850 or 900 ft/min may be more appropriate.
Don't mix those degrees up with any pitch attitude shown on your instruments. Your aircraft's nose points at one direction, while the plane itself can travel along a different path and this path forms the 3 degree angle towards the runway.
Where else could you get the necessary descent rate?
Looking at the (approach) charts, the lower right corner offers a small table with examples of possible groundspeeds.
Those values are calculated, so no thumbs included, but some trigonometry. As a matter of fact, they show you a precise rate to aim at, so on our 3 degree approach, we will see something like 849 ft/min for a GS of 160 kts.
Remember the 'add one notch' thingy? There you are!
Another source is your capable plane and its FMC.
If the thing has VNAV, it can "draw" you a path right to the threshold. What it needs is some basic data, like the aircraft's groundspeed, its current altitude and later height and the point were planet Earth starts again.
Most of this stuff will be there, without any input from you. With e. g. the Flight Director enabled and VNAV connected, it will point to a pitch attitude where the plane stays on the desired path.
Also, the deviation scale on the ND comes up.
That thing can be a bit touchy in regard to the VNAV implementation, but since we are in the sim, no real persons (only egos) will get harmed. :D
To monitor your rate of descent and the point where the commanded altitude on the MCP will be reached, you can also follow the green arc on your ND. It will point at the spot ahead of you, where the plane and the commanded altitude will be on the same level.
Test it, raise the nose slightly and it will move further away. Lower it, and the arc will come closer if aiming for a lower altitude. Dial in the runway's altitude rounded to the next 100 and place the arc on the threshold.
Still, you are trying to shoot for that 3 degree approach towards the runway.
Any altered angles, for other approaches, can be read on the corresponding charts, together with the mentioned calculated values.
Be aware that anything above 5.5 degrees is a tough task for an airliner as the descent rate for our 160 kts groundspeed example e. g. rise from the shallow 849 ft/min to a whopping 1573 ft/min.
With that much vertical speed, there's not much headroom for trying to slow the plane down, so you will come in there fully configured most of the time.
That 5.5 degree approach can only be flown by certified planes and crews, so that's a special chapter and I think some of the other guys will have some neat examples for that stuff.
If you combine the things from above, you should be fail-safe in case anything of those things was wrong.
The guys like Lou will see if the approach is correct, they've done that often enough. The sim guys suffer from a more or less flat perspective and, of course, from way lesser experience.
If you often switch the planes, this also adds on the distracting side.
Of course, if you alter your groundspeed and for example slow the plane down, your VS has to be altered accordingly, the value gets lower. Got some tailwind and the GS suddenly goes up? VS has to be increased, and so on.
That's the experience and pilot part then, although that drawn path from the VNAV will of course help you, same goes for the green arc.
Have fun. :)