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 25 767/757 Approach Advice (Read 25165 times)
trevm
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767/757 Approach Advice
Jul 14th, 2013 at 4:54am
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Hey, guys.  I've had a problem lately coordinating the FSX default ATC flight plans with the flight plans I load into the CS 767 and 757, particularly the arrival paths.  It's gotten to the point where I don't bother using a STAR, rather I fly direct to the ILS point for my arrival runway (assigned by ATC).  To get to that point, I have to disengage LNAV and VNAV and fly with the heading select and altitude hold functions until ATC clears me for the ILS approach.  Then, when I attempt to engage the localizer hold, the aircraft won't lock on. Any tips?  I apologize if I am confusing, I can't very well understand either.





  

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Markoz
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #1 - Jul 14th, 2013 at 2:43pm
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My tip would be: Don't use ATC because it does not recognize SID's and STAR's. Shocked

I only use the ATC for GA flights now. Wink
  

Mark Fletcher



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wingclip
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #2 - Oct 3rd, 2013 at 10:27pm
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trevm wrote on Jul 14th, 2013 at 4:54am:
Hey, guys.  I've had a problem lately coordinating the FSX default ATC flight plans with the flight plans I load into the CS 767 and 757, particularly the arrival paths.  It's gotten to the point where I don't bother using a STAR, rather I fly direct to the ILS point for my arrival runway (assigned by ATC).  To get to that point, I have to disengage LNAV and VNAV and fly with the heading select and altitude hold functions until ATC clears me for the ILS approach.  Then, when I attempt to engage the localizer hold, the aircraft won't lock on. Any tips?  I apologize if I am confusing, I can't very well understand either.


FWIW; There are several things that can cause a bad lock-on. If you're approaching the localizer by more than a 3 degree angle, if the attitude  of the plane is nose-up or down more than 3 degrees, and if your AGL altitude is too high, (important when it comes to FSX's POV), you may not get a lock.

For the FSX altitude 'thing', I started setting the plane to 2100 feet AGL everytime I do an ILS approach. It seems to keep FSX happy because since I've started doing that, it'll always 'see' me.

But then again, that's what I do for the Glide Slope catch. Still, I'm usually within 800' to 1000' of the 2100' AGL mark when I enter the localizer range.

So you may want to check that and of course, please disregard if you have. Smiley
  

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AndersCN
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #3 - Dec 29th, 2013 at 12:11am
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Hi,

I´m sorry to "steal" this thread, but I am still only at 33 posts Undecided

I tried to approach KSEA 34R today (110.3 MHZ, 343 degrees heading). I dialed in the frequency in the ILS radio in good time, but it just failed to "catch" the localizer and GS..?

To check this RWY out, I made an perfect approach and landing with the 707, and that was with an even more odd pitch and angle of attach that I tried before with the 767.

I remember with the 757, that all three AP light switches came on, once it caught the localizer and GS. In this trial with the 767, only one was lit, the other two were  extinguished.

Am I missing something here?

BR,
Anders
  

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Markoz
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #4 - Dec 29th, 2013 at 3:14am
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I tried to approach KSEA 34R today (110.3 MHZ, 343 degrees heading). I dialed in the frequency in the ILS radio in good time, but it just failed to "catch" the localizer and GS..?
You should not need to dial in the ILS frequency, it is added to the NAV/RAD page of the CDU upon selection of the arrival runway.

If by chance you need to add it manually, you can dial it into the ILS Tuner on the Aft Pedestal. Do not enter it in the VOR Tuners (on the Glareshield) as they are not used for APP by the MCP (AP).
The format for adding the ILS frequency/heading to the NAV/RAD page of the CDU is XXX.XX/XXX (i.e. 110.10\343) in LSK4L.

In my image below, I selected ILS34R as the arrival runway, and the frequency/heading were automatically added to the NAV/RAD page of the CDU and to the ILS Tuner on the aft pedestal.

  

Mark Fletcher



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AndersCN
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #5 - Dec 29th, 2013 at 6:58am
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Thank you very much for the promt reply Smiley

I acually selected "34R" in the ARR section of the DEP/ARR page, not ILS34R. And by selecting just 34R, the ILS frequency did not change to 110.3, but remained at the frequency it had before. Thus I dialed it manually ( not in the VOR radios). However, I did not check the NAV/RAD page Undecided
So, in the ARR airports with an ILSxxx option, you should select this as the arrival? Or at least make sure it is in the NAV/RAD page afterwards?

BR,
Anders
  

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Markoz
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #6 - Dec 30th, 2013 at 3:06am
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Under certain "missing T/D" or the "missing end of the route" problems, I always select the ILS Runway, then, if needed, I'll simply select the runway without any preceding info (RNAV, ILS, etc.). In this case, I would select ILS34R, then IF I find the T/D is missing or the route is incomplete, then I go back and select 34R as the arrival. I also usually add a STAR and insert any extra waypoints that are a part of the ILS Approach (from SimPlates ULTRA) to help me hook up with the ILS and GS for 34R.

NOTE: Because I already selected ILS34R as the arrival, the Frequency/Heading for the ILS is already entered into the CDU RAD/NAV page AND the ILS Tuner! So it saves having to enter it manually. Wink
  

Mark Fletcher



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AndersCN
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #7 - Dec 31st, 2013 at 8:17am
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Well, I got it work Smiley
I don't know exactly what I did, maybe I got the STAR and TRANS right this time!
As soon as the right ILS frequency is automatically entered in the tuner in the first place, it will smoothly follow the glideslope down to the RWY.

But for some reason it landed approx. 50 meters to the right parallel to the RWY? Is this a bug in FSX?

Best Regards and thank you again for the advice,
Anders
  

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Markoz
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #8 - Dec 31st, 2013 at 8:55am
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AndersCN wrote on Dec 31st, 2013 at 8:17am:
But for some reason it landed approx. 50 meters to the right parallel to the RWY? Is this a bug in FSX?
Hmm. Strange. I don't recall that happening to me at all. It might be that the navigation runway database has the threshold 50 metres right of where it really is (at least where it is in FSX). The biggest problem with the newer AIRACS, is that they are based on the real life ones, so things might change hear and there, but a runway 50 metres off, sounds wrong to me.
  

Mark Fletcher



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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #9 - Jan 1st, 2014 at 8:33am
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This is also the first time I land so far off the runway. I may try a few other airports with the 767 to see what it does there.

Best Regards,
Anders
  

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fuzzy11
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #10 - Jan 1st, 2014 at 1:53pm
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It might have something to do with the fact that FSX is 10+ years old now and the magnetic variation.  MVAR moves every year (it's about one degree every year), so not sure how the FSX chart people factor that into their nav databases.
  
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #11 - Jan 2nd, 2014 at 2:31am
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Although that's true fuzzy11, I've never landed 50 metres off the runway yet (at least not using AUTOLAND).

Anders. Can you provide the entire route details please (departure runway, SID, Jetways/waypoints, STAR and arrival runway). I would like to test it to see the same thing happens to me when I fly it.
  

Mark Fletcher



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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #12 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 12:01pm
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I´m away from my Sim PC now, I will return later with the entire flightplan from KLAX-KSEA that I used.

BR,
Anders
  

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Markoz
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #13 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 4:03pm
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I have just finished flying from KLAX to KSEA.

The route:
RW07R GMN4.EHF J65 RBL J1 BTG HAWKS3.BTG ILS34R.SONDR

The ILS/GS capture was fine and so was the approach and landing. My 767-300 landing right in the centre of the runway.

Here are some images of my approach and landing:







I even did a test landing with the Heading Preference Switch set to TRUE instead of NORM (in the red box of the next 3 images), just in case it might have been the cause of your problem, but it came straight in and still landed in the centre of the runway. Images of that landing:







Still not sure why you are landing 50 metres off the runway. Undecided
  

Mark Fletcher



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AndersCN
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Re: 767/757 Approach Advice
Reply #14 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 8:32pm
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Thank you very much for your help. I am really amazed with how much effort you put into this.

The route I was flying is this:

RW25R CASTA2.EHF EHF J5 LKV J67 BTG OLM.BTG RW34R

The Frequency 110.3 and CRS 343 now goes automatically in the ILS tuner.
Heading Preference Switch is in Norm.

But next step for me will be to fly the exact same route as you have used.

A few questions.
Do all three A/P´s lit (engage) when you "catch" the GS and Localizer?
In my case only the left one (L) lits as it does during the flight.

Do I have to dial the CRS (343 in this case) in the HDG of the MCP?

Best Regards,
Anders
  

AMD Phenom II X6 1100T BE @ 3,9GHz&&Noctua NH-D14&&EVGA GTX 570&&4 GB GSkill 1600/7-8-7-24&&Asrock 990FX Extreme4&&850W XFX bronze&&CM HAF 912&&120 GB OCZ SSD, 250 GB Velociraptor, 1 TB WD Black&&Dell 24 inch 1920x1200&&Thrustmaster T1600M&&Windows 7/64 HP&&REX E Plus OD, FSG2010, FTXGlobal/Vector/O
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